Tiff Finney | Too Confident?

Tiff Finney joins me in this podcast to discuss her journey to finding her style, what inspires her and potential festival recommendations...

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Sarah: Welcome to ... I did actually just try and start it and then she was like, "Wait! Question." So we had to do it again. So, Hi Tiffany probably for the third time I've said Hi now...

Tiff: Hiyaa! You alright?

Sarah: I'm alright. Can you show everyone your tits 'cos you're wearing one of my tops? Oh it looks so good. Oh! And the leggings too!

Tiff: I just fell over trying to do it.

Sarah: You covered it well. You covered it well. It's fine.

Tiff: Nice.

Sarah: And how are you gorgeous creature? Oh yeah, I'm not even wearing Off The Pole wear. I feel bad. I should be branded…

Tiff: You suck, mate.

Sarah: I know. Oh well. So how's life? How is ... How is everything in Tiffany's world?

Tiff: All good. Just keeping on at it. Got loads of workshops, I'm around the UK constantly this year and we've got an intensive pole weekend this weekend. Just trying to keep on dancing as much as I can. 'Cos I feel like sometimes I don't get enough time.

Sarah: Yes, this is very true. I think there's a bit misconception with people who are, like, professional pole dancers. That we just hang out and train and dance all day. When, in fact, it's like completely the opposite. We actually get, like, a little half hour/hour snippet where we record as much as possible and then just throw that on Instagram for the next month.

Tiff: Yeah. The idea is that you record within a half an hour period and that'll last you for two weeks.

Sarah: Yes, sometimes even changing outfits midway through the training session to make it look like you've actually trained more often than you actually have...

Tiff: That's exactly it.

Sarah: I did say that to the other day to someone and they were quite shocked.

Tiff: Insider. Inside the reveal.

Sarah: We shouldn't really say that really, but oh well.

Tiff: It sounds pixelated.

Sarah: You disappeared for a minute, but you're back. I'm in Thailand so my wi-fi is probably terrible so we're just going to see what we can capture. We might have to do this again, but I don't mind.

Tiff: Now, are you having a nice time?

Sarah: I'm having a good time, yes. A very, very nice time. It's night time here, which is why the curtains are drawn, but ... I'm glad we got a little bit of time to chat-

Tiff: I'm glad to hear it, back to me! (laughs)

Sarah: 'Enough about you!' So, yeah, I did want to get you to talk a little bit about some of the posts you've been putting up on Instagram and Facebook. A lot about self-confidence. You've got the "You are enough" kind of movement that you've created. So I just ... Yeah, I wanted to kind of maybe get a little bit of insight about when that started. Maybe was there always this desire for you to put that out into the world? Or is it something you've had to develop yourself and then felt that it was a good message to start sharing?

Tiff: Yeah, I think, like, ten years ago, I was so insecure it was insane. I just ... I just couldn't appreciate anything about myself and I didn't like myself at all. And one day I had this epiphany where you see when you've got a boyfriend and it's getting serious and it's all exciting and then things start to become normal and then you think, "I can't be all things for this person." So thinking, "I can't be tall like a supermodel and cute and petite. I can't have really long, luxurious hair and like a really cool pixie crop."

Just thought you can't possibly be all of those things. I was thinking, "Men just like everything." And you can't be all of those things so instead ... No matter what you do, how much surgery you buy, or whatever it is that you do, that it's never going to be everything. SO I thought, "JESUS, what the is the point?" Instead, I should just go, "Cool. I've got these things and I can just appreciate the opposite things in other people because I'm never going to be all of those things."

And, why should you need to be? And then I realised I was making ... Putting value on things based on what men would think and what men like and what men want. It's like, why am I'm not even sleeping with them? Like, why am I trying to look nice for them? Like, what the fuck is the point? It was like an epiphany, I don't need to be all of these things. I can just have what I've got and enjoy that and appreciate I don't on other people. Like, easy as that. It's as simple as that.

Sarah: This was about ten years ago? Was this before or after you started pole?

Tiff: I'm so sorry. I've just had a message come through off Chilli Rox

Sarah: Is that sharable? Or is it not sharable?

Tiff: Well, it's just willy cakes. There's, like, this big festival of willy cakes and I think she wants us to go.

Sarah: Of course, of course, she does. Where is this willy cake festival? I didn't even know there was such a thing?

Tiff: I don't know. I've not clicked on yet. So-

Sarah: We shouldn't really be reading messages...(laughs)

Tiff: It might be local?

Sarah: Well, yeah, maybe it is... Everyone's now, like, switching off the podcast and Googling willy cakes festival. You've just ruined it.

Tiff: I would understand. I would understand. I'm sorry we were talking about something really important then weren't we?

Sarah: Probably not. Now we're talking about something important. Willy cake festival. Is there anything more important? I don't think so. Willy cake. It's so specific as well. Like, not just, like, a willy festival, but a willy cake festival.

Tiff: Absolutely, it's all fully edible and it's just cake.

Sarah: Just baked goods in phallus form.

Tiff: Absolutely ... With well-placed icing.

Sarah: Thank you for the hand gesture. For those reading. For those just listening...

Tiff: I'm so sorry. I can't do under 18 Sarah, I can't do it.

Sarah: No one said this was under 18. You let fly. You do whatever you want. It's fine. So, yeah, what we were talking about before? Oh yeah, before or after pole? Did you have this epiphany Tiffany before or after pole?

Tiff: Love it. It's after so ... Hang on. How old was I? I was twenty ... So what I did. I actually tried stripping. So it was, like, kind of started pole class just after stripping.

The reason I did stripping is that I wanted to feel good about meself and it was, like, this big challenge that I had where I was like, "Fuck it. Just try it. Just try it." And it was brilliant. I had a great time and it made me genuinely think, "Alright body. I can do what I want with you." And when you kind of know that men are into that you go, "Oh. Men are into it. So what?" You know, big deal. Now I can move it the way I want to. So it was, like, amazing for that.

And I went to my first pole class. And it was just instant. It was like, "Wow." You can do something that would turn a man on, but when you know that you can do that and have that ability. You have that power. That's when you go, "I don't want to use it for that." It's so far beyond that. You just think, "That's great ... That's good. Not going to pay for me dinner is it? It's not going to make me want to get out of bed every day."

Pole itself, like, it's you doing it and you being able to do this amazing shit with your body, which I hadn't felt since I played football when I was younger. So, that is the first time since then. It's mint!

Sarah: It's quite ironic really that people get into pole I think or people looking from the outside think people do pole to please the opposite sex and try and do it for something for their partners and things like that, but it actually turns 'round ... flips 'round just to be completely about them...

Tiff: It really does.

Sarah: ...and nothing about other people. So, I think it's the most ironic thing about pole, really. Is that people can get it completely wrong.

Tiff: Yeah. It's entirely for the self. I think when you feel ... And it's that people say you can't be empowered if you're a pole dancer. I've seen, and I love comedy but David Mitchell said this and I was a huge fan of his and then he said he didn't think you could really be empowered as a pole dancer.

No! You can! When you realise that you could do something as appealing, really alluring to somebody of the opposite sex or same sex that's when you go, "Great. I have that power." So then it stops being important.

When you have ... When you feel like you're in control it stops being as important to you. It's the things you don't have power or control over. They are the things that you think about.

So, then with pole training, you start thinking about, "How am I going to get stronger? Get fitter? How am I going to come up with this routine? Create something new?" That is what you're trying control and when and do well at.

So the ... Being able to turn a guy on- big deal. It's boring. You know what I mean? When I pole dance on stage and it's all I've got these boobs and have fun and I'm playing about, but nobody's getting a boner from that.

Sarah: I mean, I do....

Tiff: Really.

Sarah: Internally. Like a spiritual boner. Yeah.

Tiff: It is. A spirit boner! I like that. I wonder if you can get cakes for those?

Sarah: Spirit boner festival? I'd go to that.

Tiff: And next!

Sarah: It's just any kind of cake festival with phallus is one the list. I don't know why, but we're going to have to keep referring back to that now. It's always going to come back.

Tiff: I know. Absolutely. It's going to have to happen.

Sarah: Yeah, I wanna go. But do you find...obviously, it was very ... It was a eureka moment for you. You found it quite a clear cut, like, eureka moment, but have you found because, obviously, you run a studio now, very successful. You have done for many years, but do you find that people come into your studio and struggle with that transition? Or do you find that it's, literally, if they're encouraged along that pathway they will get there? Or is it something that some people might have to, like, actively, consciously decide to start to feel that way?

Tiff: Yeah, everybody is different. You see it's the people that you can see that sparkle that first class. Where they go ... And the next class, it's like a different person has walked in and then some people it's an ongoing thing. People that are taking the more advanced class that have been with me for years are still working on it, but it's ... You see that they have it and that they've come a huge, huge way. But they still don't fully believe it yet. If that makes sense.

Sarah: Do you have things that you try to encourage them to do or think about to help them along that way? I know a lot of what you teach in your workshops and stuff is very much about confidence building and that's, obviously, how you teach. But are there any tips that you can share that would help people who can't necessarily get to one of your workshops?

Tiff: I don't think I necessarily teach or do any talks about confidence during workshops. It's more, "Let's have fun!" in the workshops. When you take pressure, that pressure out of the workshop, that's when it becomes fun and you're not thinking about it so much. Just give it a go and you fall over. Who cares? At least you're trying.

So I think with the students, I just say, "Just try," but sometimes you have to know when they're not ready to go all out and you've got to allow them to take things in their own pace.

Not everybody's me. Not everybody is just like whipping their top off every two seconds, but, you know, to make people laugh. You know, I just don't give a shit. I think it's because age helps as well.

I think it's important that all of them get ... And they're just not there yet and I think you can't force it out of people or make it this huge deal and say, "We need to get you confident. You have to do this now. If you do this, you'll be" ... Because then it's going to be stifling I think for some people.

You have to take people as you find them. You can tell straightaway with someone if they've got that naughty glint in their eye. You know they want twerk and slam 'em off the ground. You know it's in them straightaway ... With those people, all you've got to do is show them some floor work. Some floor-whoring and they're on it. And some people you gotta take your time. Working up to wearing heels. You've just gotta say, "You can do this in your own pace. It's your life. Only you live in your mind. So trust yourself to know when you can just start." And that little bit more. You've just got to be there for them, for their pace.

Sarah: Yep. Definitely. Yeah, I think if you start to say, "You should be feeling really confident," they're going to start to feel really anxious about the fact that they're not feeling confident and then under-confident about the fact that they haven't necessarily found their confidence yet. So it might be a bit of a vicious circle.

Tiff: Exactly. Exactly. It's one of the most difficult things in the world is to get confidence when you have barriers. And barriers that have been put up, not just because of you, but from outside influences. The media or the friends and family and strangers even. So, it's one of the most difficult things in the world to break that down when it's been there for a lifetime.

Sarah: Yeah, like, confidence a lot of the time is seen as arrogance or being, like, loud or attention seeking or narcissistic. There's a lot of negative words that come along with people who are outwardly confident in a weird social media situation where we all like half the time encouraged to be posting and sharing. If you do, you're like slapped back by society being like, "I can't believe she's posted that. I can't believe she's sharing all of this stuff." You can't really win a lot of the time so it's a difficult, bumpy road.

Tiff: So, I wrote a blog a few years ago about being sexy and it's ... And confident so you know the phrase, "They're too confident." WHAT!? YOU'RE TOO CONFIDENT?! You're only allowed to be confident to a certain point and after that, you're an asswipe. And it's like, "Because I don't hate meself I'm not allowed to be liked by other people." It's awful because that word "too" shouldn't be able to come in front of the word "confident." It's just backwards to me.

And, that's the thing, so it's likely people struggle with getting confident because they don't know where that ceiling is. They don't know where that limit is so that they, "Well, I can't be too confident, but I don't know where" I mean. You can't win.

And the thing is, though, only you ... live in your mind. You're living your life and you can be confident and a good person. You can't be too confident. As long as you aren't just an asshole, like a bad person, and disguise it as confidence. Obviously, that's a different thing. You've got self-esteem. That is the one thing that will make your life mean something. It will make it worthwhile because as I just said, "Only you live in your mind." So when you get to the end of life, can you just imagine just going, "Ohhhhhh. I should've just done that." Who's thanking you for not doing things that can bring you joy or make you feel good? Nobody.

Sarah: And half the time it's normally just a reflection of someone else's limitations that they're putting on to you and, like, they don't want to do it so they don't think other people should so they're going to feel better about the fact that they're not doing it.

So, I think that was a big thing for me when I realised that, "Okay. So you're not going to please everybody. Some people are going to hate the fact that you're doing well because they may be not doing well. Some people are going to hate the fact you're confident because they're not confident. Other people aren't going to like you. That's fine as well. You can't please everybody. Certainly not.

As you said earlier you can't be everything to everybody just, like, find your circle. Do your thing and crack on. Nothing actually bad happens if you just get on. No one actually cares what you're getting up to.

Tiff: NOBODY CARES. Nobody actually cares about you. You mean that in the nicest way. I think ... My girls that compete when they're really just like, "Ohhh I've gotta back up. Gotta go on stage." Nobody cares. You mean that in the nicest way. Your ... They're not waiting for you all day. They're not going to be thinking about you all day the next day. They're not going to be wondering what you've been through to get there. They're just gonna see you on stage and they'll go, "That was cool. That was brilliant" and they'll love it. Or if it goes really badly, they'll just forget about you because they've got a life to live as well just as much as you have.

Nobody cares so you might as well just do what you want to do. It's like what you were saying about other the ... It's a representation of other people's limitations. It's like every person is almost like a red flag so ... Like you said, if you're successful, somebody that's having a bad time doesn't like you because of that success. It's just because you're a big red flag going, "I'm successful. You're not. I'm skinny and you're not." Yeah, "I get up in the morning. You don't." It's not the person that we're hating, it's just, you know, we recognise failures.

It's like a mirror for failure, but everybody is different and everybody has all of these things. It's unnecessary pressure to put on themselves. You almost don't need to.

Sarah: Social media is a blessing and a curse. I think I've talked to you about this ... It does get brought up a lot on these podcasts and, obviously, it's in our life every day, in our hands, thrown in our face all of the time.

Social media is fantastic because it opens things up. We can share podcasts like this. I can talk to you from different countries and it's fantastic. And we can be inspired by each other, but, also, I think it puts a huge amount of pressure.

There's ... I think I've mentioned ... I probably just talk about the same shit in these podcasts all of the time, but we're human beings that aren't meant to have interactions with more than 150 people. Our brains can't cope. We don't actually ... We're not meant to agree with everybody or get on with everybody. That's our limit. If you've got thousands of friends on Facebook or even 200 friends that's almost too many for you to handle! That's why if you need to just take a step back, realise it's not real life, realise people have their own shit to deal with. You don't need to put a post up that day or you don't need to do the best performance of your life and if it does go wrong, it's not the end of the world. If you don't get that trick before that person, doesn't really matter in the grand scheme of things.

It's good to be dedicated. It's good to care about your work and your passion, like pole, but I think people do put a lot of pressure on themselves about where their level is in comparison to other people. And that really knocks their confidence.

And it's actually a shame because pole should be empowering, and fun, and use it as a way to feel better about themselves not feel worse. And I see that quite often now. It's people get really down about doing pole. They're like, "Oh. I've been doing it a year, but-

Tiff: I see that all of the time-

Sarah: It's a year. It's like no time. It's a blip. No time.

Tiff: Yeah. Absolutely. And you're totally right. I feel like people are less confident now with pole than they ever were. Before ... You know, back when we had Karol Helms on YouTube-

Sarah: Shout out Karol...

Tiff: You know and then ... Shout out Karol. That was incredible and then the whole social media exploded after that. I think before all you had was your peers really and the pole class. And that is just you going, "Waaay." You can fart and get a cheer. And then now, it's like...shout out Heidi Hildersley... I know it's terrible.

The community is humongous, which should be amazing, but I think people are less confident. And, actually, you should use it as an opportunity to say, "God pole has diversified" so what. I can reach so many people that even if a few people like what I do. They're like, "Yeah! Go you! Go you! Go you!" You don't have to be the creator of this or the creator of that to get the move.

Just do it in a nice outfit with a nice background. Put a cool filter on it. You're done. Your work for the week is done. You'll feel good and behind closed doors, you can fail some tricks and failing is succeeding. Because every time you fail, you're closer to succeeding. But you don't have to put that bit online, if you don't want to, but then people love to see a journey.

Sarah: They do. And you can always share it on Polelols when it goes wrong...

Tiff: Exactly. Oh my god. I keep getting shared on Polelols so I think my life is more failure than success, but c'mon Polelols. That good.

Sarah: You've put a video up recently. We've been following your journey of flat-back syndrome that you've got. Which is very frustrating for you because you've put a lot of work into going to the gym.

Tiff: Posterior pelvic tilt.

Sarah: Posterior pelvic tilt. But then you did a really good follow up video where you were like, "This is what I'm working with, but this is all of the cool shit I can do with it." And you were, like, "It's not maybe the stuff you would expect that I can even do, but actually I can make it look really good. And I still have that issue on top of that." So, I think you were doing splits and looking bendy and doing all sorts of stuff. So you can see just because you have this issue doesn't mean you shouldn't even bother to attempt anything. Because you can actually make it look really, really good.

Work to your strengths is such a benefit. I think I was talking to students this weekend and I was like, "I can't do this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this" and listed off a million things in pole that I cannot do and will never do. And I don't care. Not even a little bit. Not bothered. Not even slightly interested.

Tiff: I do an extended butterfly and it is, honestly, horrific. Like, I'm just, "Oh no." "I bet you it's really good. It's really good. Oh. You're just playing. You're trying to make us feel better." And I do it and they go, "Oooooooooooooh." And nobody actually films it or takes a picture because they know I won't want to see it. And it's hilarious. I just find it funny. I love the fact that it looks so terrible. There's something about it. And I just find that funny.

That's just part of pole. Why should we be good at everything? Just have a laugh.

Sarah: Exactly. And just don't do those things. And you shouldn't always be like trying to improve stuff you're bad at. I'm not just saying like just do the stuff you're good at, but also accept the fact that some things aren't going to work with your body type, your structure, your flexibility, your lifestyle. Some things just don't work. It's just like a metal piece of apparatus that we move around. You're not going to be able to do every single combination of movement on that thing.

Tiff: So, for instance, I don't do ... I don't really do a lot of spin pole at all. Just because you find gorgeous poses on spin that I just really love to watch, but I don't look as good as I want to when I'm doing it. Like, "OH. Hm.." It's good to do them because I enjoy having a go, but when I look at it back, It doesn't look great. So I use static pole because I like to move.

Sarah: Everybody likes dynamic.

Tiff: Yeah, take this! Take that! That's what I love to do. I just do that all of the time. And then when I do a guest performance, I say, "Can I have them both on static please? Thank you."

Sarah: Or, "I'm just going to be doing some floor work and a little bit of static."

Tiff: Exactly. Exactly. It's no big deal.

Sarah: No, it's ... I think most people would think they think, especially if they are a professional pole dancer, that you can do everything and that we all share all of the latest trending tricks. And that we're just like, "Oh, yeah. I tried that straightaway and I could do it." There are tricks that are intermediate tricks that I'm like, "Gah. I'm not even going to do it." It's just not in the realms of my repertoire and that's fine. I don't enjoy teaching them. I don't enjoy doing them. So I don't do them. And I don't worry about it. No one has to see them.

Tiff: Exactly. And I think people should employ that same the same thing by just do the things that you enjoy. It's like what we were saying before: train the things that are your weak points that you want to improve on, like, strength. Train. Try and get stronger. That's a good thing because when you achieve something like that and you can measure progress. Like, "I'm getting a bit thinner this week." That is amazing for your confidence. It's sort of a wonderful thing-

Sarah: Overcoming little challenges, seeing improvement. That's all amazing-

Tiff: Satisfaction. That sense of satisfaction and if that gives you that John Travolta swagger when you're off to get your milk, that's what gives you that.

Sarah: Specific, but yeah.

Tiff: It's so good to do. That is a good walk, mate.

Sarah: The walk is good, but only to milk or other beverages?

Tiff: Other beverages. I thought, I'll just say one and that should cover it all. Otherwise I'll be here all day.

Sarah: Very true. I'm just being awkward. Sorry.

Tiff: Red wine.

Sarah: That's better. Thank you. I can swagger to my wine

Tiff: (Singing) "And you can tell by the way I roll my walk, I'm a woman's man no time to talk" That's what happens when you get your first deadlift!

Sarah: Definitely. That's what I did for sure.

I did have a question from someone in the Off the Pole group. Georgina Watson, she wanted to know, "How did you find your "style?" She did it in these quote marks.

"It's so unique and I love it"

Tiff: Ah, thanks mate!

Sarah: Nearly left off the compliment. Sorry!

Tiff: Yeah. So ten years of pole definitely Nadia Sharif and Annemarie from years and years ago. I saw Nadia dance and I was like, "OOOOOHHHHHHH!!! That's what it could look like?! Are you shitting me?!" Just couldn't believe what I was seeing. It was just incredible. And then, Annemarie the way she moves. The way she looks at people. It's just how self-assured she is. So, right from the early days, I was obsessed with the pair of them. Absolutely loved them.

But then I think I've been influenced by a lot of things. Have you seen Police Academy?

Sarah: Yes.

Tiff: Callahan.

Sarah: Amazing.

Tiff: Blonde hair. The red Adidas trackkies. Just the way she looked. They filmed it with high leg with the legs so high like, the pants looped up to here and it was like, yeah, and I was like, "What a woman. What a woman."

Tina Turner. Just watching "I'm your private dancer." Watching her move.

I just love watching people and women just in control of their bodies. Pammy running down a beach in slow-mo. If you're not inspired by that, I, like ... Who else makes their career out of running that slow?

Sarah: Homework, everyone needs to go on YouTube, Pammy running slow, and then go pole training and just see what happens. I think everyone ...

Tiff: OH MY GOD.

Sarah: Everyone is going to be seeing a big increase in motivation. I want a report back and tell us what they got after doing that.

Tiff: You're welcome guys. You're welcome.

Sarah: 'Training tips with Tiff Finey'

Tiff: If there's one thing you watch today, watch this.

Sarah: I want to someone to come back and be like, "I got my Spatchcock!!" Who knew that was the answer?

Tiff: That's brilliant. Yeah, clothes. I love expression with clothes. Wear whatever you want and that makes it. That gives you swag when you're on the pole and you fling. I would always say, "Dress up."

Sarah: It's, like, a different character. It's, like, getting out of your ... I always think I've got a bit of a teaching brain. Like, if I walk into a classroom, "Right, let's get this class started." You have a teaching brain on and then you kind of almost become a slightly different person, like a teaching persona where you're, like, really full of energy. Even if I'm super, super tired, as soon as I'm teaching I'm, like, full of energy and ready to go. And then if you wear a certain outfit, like, if you wearing quite, like, ... Cold clothes or it's quite drab or you've just come from maybe, like, work and you go to your studio for a ... But as soon as you put a pole of shoes on or a new outfit, then you can be, like-

Tiff: A pole of shoes?

Sarah: A pole of shoes. A new pair of shoes.

Tiff: Okay.

Sarah: A pole of shoes. That could be a thing.

Tiff: Absolutely. It makes ... It does make a difference.

Sarah: Your outfits are something else though. I don't think I've got quite the creative brain to wear some of your outfits.

I'm just like I'm going to buy an outfit and wear it from, like, a pole shop. And you get, like, pull loads of different random things together. Like, you had a hula hoop in your ... One of your shoots. And didn't you wear a hat? It's like a ... You weren't wearing it like this-

Tiff: It just looked better as a neck brace.

Sarah: That's what you do. Cool shit like that. But it looks amazing. I don't think anyone can pull it off quite like you can.

Tiff: See I think everybody can. Just do it.

Sarah: I'm going to start wearing. I'm just looking around, "What can I wear as a neck brace?"

Tiff: You have a lampshade. You have a lampshade behind you.

Sarah: Hat? You could wear it as a wrist cuff and do something cool with it.

Tiff: Exactly. A wrist cuff. That's exactly what it is. You've got this.

Sarah: Thanks, babe. Oh, this wi-fi is failing us. I think, now. It's getting jumpy.

Tiff: Is it? It sounds okay.

Sarah: It does sound okay. I think it is recording slightly better than I'm seeing on the screen, but we're nearly at forty minutes. See, I told you, it goes quick!

Tiff: No! No way.

Sarah: Yeah. See it goes quick. So, we'll probably have to get you on again. One, when I have slightly better wi-fi. And, two, that we can just chat more because you're fantastic and I love you. Thank you for coming on.

Tiff: I love you so much!

Sarah: Thanks! Thank you for coming on and sharing some of your wisdom. The Pammy trick and the other things we've managed to cover in forty minutes.

Tiff: Go off the pole! Go off the pole!

Sarah: Thanks for wearing my clothes and making them look amazing. You're a star. Oh. Look at that.

Tiff: (Kisses finger) That's one of what the beauty kids do.

Sarah: The beauty kids?

Tiff: Yeah. I've seen it

Sarah: Is it?

Tiff: Yeah, to the judges. If someone does that for me absolutely will get extra points.

Sarah: Noted. I hope everyone's listening to that. You're at Dance Filthy soon? Are you judging or comparing? Comparing?

Tiff: Comparing. Yeah. I'm definitely the one to compare that one. I think. I'm definitely the one for that. Are you gonna be there?

Sarah: No, but, I think I'm going to do the Northern one maybe and definitely be at Pole Weekender, which is the best!

Tiff: And Pole Theatre?

Sarah: I'll be at Pole Theatre. All of the usuals. We all just meet up at these Stacey (Snedden) run events throughout the year.